NCGP GP Kerry Werner and an AMA with Kerry/Kenny/Jerry

We caught up with the cyclocross prodigal son and held an impromptu AMA with the man of many alter egos

The cyclocross prodigal son Kerry Werner returned between the tape at the North Carolina Grand Prix this past weekend. The event has a lot of history for Werner since he attended college at Lees-McRae and then lived in North Carolina for a number of years post-college. It’s where he got his first UCI win, and over the weekend, he won the race for the 10th and 11th times.

I thought it would be a good time to catch up with Werner since we haven’t seen him since Charm City. I also had a little fun with it, putting up a last-minute Tweet soliciting questions from the ‘cross community for a Kerry/Kenny/Jerry AMA. I think the results are worth scrolling through for.

Kerry/Kenny/Jerry was back between the tape over the weekend at the NCGP. © Bill Schieken

Interview: Kerry Werner, NCGP Double Winner

Zach Schuster: How was it being back between the tape this weekend?

Kerry Werner: Oh, it was sweet, especially being at the NCGP. That race has a lot of history for me. I took my first UCI win there, and then this weekend, I took my 11th win at that race.

Zach Schuster: I was gonna ask about that. I feel like it might need to be renamed the GP Kerry Werner.

Kerry Werner: I don't know about that man.

Zach Schuster: We hadn't seen you since Charm City, so I'm guessing it was good to be back in the scene and see some familiar faces again as well?

Kerry Werner: Exactly. Plus it was back to the racing I really enjoy. Sometimes the gravel racing can be kind of boring because it's such a long and drawn-out effort. It's nice to get back into that anxiety and fast-paced attacking. It's full of intensity. It was nice, I missed that.

Zach Schuster: Our guys Brunner and White weren't there, but you still had some hitters in your field. How were you preparing going into the weekend and what were you expecting?

Kerry Werner: The big emphasis for me is on Nationals. Iceman was two weeks before Hendersonville. I was focused on that, and then after Iceman, I had a weekend off and hit the training pretty good. Got in some motor pacing sessions. I wouldn't say I was training through it, but I definitely didn't approach it as I would if it was a race I was really gunning for.

But with that said, I wasn't super tired heading into it. I had good legs. With Eric and Curtis not being there, it let some other people shine. Tobin showed up. Tyler Orschel was there. I kind of forgot how good he is, and then about halfway through Day 1, I was like, "Oh yeah, I raced with Tyler at Iceman and he got 4th, so I need to start paying attention."

Zach Schuster: There was no real broadcast for the races. How did they play out? Were they similar, were they different? How did you get your wins?

Kerry Werner: The course at Hendersonville when it's dry tends to lend itself to tactical group racing. That was even more so the case on Sunday with the win. Saturday with it being the first race back, I really wanted to get out there and see how I was feeling and make it pretty hard and break it up. I tried to do a good bit of work early and always put myself on the front or near the front. It ended up being Tyler, Tobin, and me breaking away in the last quarter of the race. It stayed together a good bit, and the gaps never really got very big.

Then coming into the last lap, it was the three of us. There was one really defining technical feature maybe a minute into the lap. There was a super-tricky off-camber, and Tyler lost his front wheel there. I got around him, and got a 5-second gap right away that allowed me to smash through the rest of the lap. I was able to hold him off and get the win.

Werner, Tyler Orschel, and Tobin Ortenblad were the top three men at the NCGP. © Bill Schieken

Then Day 2 it was windy, so it was even more tactical. Tyler's Canadian, so I don't know if he was thinking about training for Canadian Nationals, but he just got on the front and started smashing three laps into the race. He pulled us around for literally four or five laps. Once he got to the front, he never got off the front.

Zach Schuster: That's really nice of him.

Kerry Werner: The crazy thing is he was going hard the whole time. I would have been keen to do some work with him, but he never let up the pace or flicked us through. It was Tyler, Tobin, and me again. Tobin and I were just sitting on Tyler's wheel waiting for him to flick us through or do something. But he kept upping the pace and kept on the gas the whole time.

Then in the last lap, he really lit it up. I kept telling myself that he's pushing it and there's no reason to go around him. There was a 150-meter sprint at the finish, and I kept saying if he's been leading the last four laps and he's going this hard on the last lap, it doesn't seem likely he'll have the snap to hold it in the sprint. I put all my eggs in that basket, and it worked out. I got around him for the sprint.

Werner played his tactics right and won the sprint on Day 2 of the NCGP. © Bill Schieken

Zach Schuster: You've been away, but it sounds like you're still able to think pretty strategically about your racing. You haven't lost that.

Kerry Werner: I just like it. Always having to think is one of the things I love about 'cross racing. As soon as you've tuned out, you've lost the race. You have to stay engaged, and you're just constantly thinking, what if this happens, should I go here? You're always checking people's body language. It's like a big hour of focus as much it is an hour of fitness.

Zach Schuster: One question I had is about training. Looking at someone like me, I do gravel in the spring and get good base miles in and then start to layer in the intensity for 'cross. How have you managed these competing goals, doing gravel but also wanting to do well in cyclocross?

Kerry Werner: It's really interesting for me. The last bunch of years I had basically done the first six weeks of the 'cross schedule. It's pretty full-on for the first six weeks or so with all the C1s and World Cups. Coming out of those six weeks, historically, I've been kind of flat and come into Nationals not quite where I need to be. Not doing all those races this year and not having all that early intensity, I kind of feel like maybe I have a little more to give at the end of the season. The workouts I am putting in are hopefully going to sharpen the axe instead of just wear away metal.

Zach Schuster: One thing we've always loved about you is you are like the people's hero. You raced every race. You did the full Cyclocross Stage Race of America. You've had different goals. Is this you're preferred way to come into Nats? You mentioned being bummed about not getting to race 'cross, but looking forward are you going to become Marianne Vos and lay it on late?

Kerry Werner: I'm very excited for Nationals. I still have two weekends to get some last-minute training in and make the fitness pointy. I'll also be shutting it down after Nationals, so it's a big carrot to chase, being able to get a result I can hang my hat on. Just sponsor-wise, in the near future in 2023 I'm going to be on more or less the same program. There is going to be a little bit of a change up next year that we can talk about on January 1. Looking forward, I probably won't be able to do the 'cross I've done the past. Fingers crossed I'll get a good result at Nationals.

I'd like to be able to throw some more cyclocross into my schedule. I would have liked to have done maybe two more races or even targeted the USCX Series to a larger extent. Maybe next year. We'll see what the gravel schedule holds.

Zach Schuster: We're seeing a little bit of the changing of the guard in the field. Brunner is a superstar. Curtis is still racing well. But you're holding your own. You've gotten some nice results this season. I feel like you're still racing cyclocross pretty well.

Kerry Werner: I am. That's not to say I don't realize where I am in age. I am 31. I'm checking all these results sheets, and I'm like, "Dang, I'm one of the older guys now."

Zach Schuster: Yup. Happens.

Kerry Werner: It definitely has crossed my mind thinking about how many more years I can stay at the top. But I don't really put much energy into thinking about that now. I'm stoked with where I am, and I'm just going to keep riding it out.

Zach Schuster: You haven't won Nats yet, but I look at the life you've gotten to live in bike racing, and I think you've been pretty blessed. You've gotten to do so many cool things with your cycling career. But is there some sense that winning Nationals matters to your legacy?

Kerry Werner: Absolutely. Who doesn't want to win Nationals? It's the biggest thing you can do in any cycling discipline in America. Obviously there's World Cups and World Champs and stuff, but that's a little bit out of reach, at least on the Men's side, but there are a lot of fast Junior guys coming up, but at least right now, you win Nats, you've signed the book. That's definitely something I want to put on the CV before I do eventually call it quits.

That's not on my mind at all though. I know some people have seen my name on the Single Speed start sheet, so I want to nip that in the bud right away.

Zach Schuster: We'll get to that! We actually have some listener questions, and we'll get to that in a bit. The first time we met was at Hartford Nationals. You had turned in a 3rd-place ride on a pretty epic day. Knowing you've done well before, what's it like returning to a Nationals venue? We don't do that anymore.

Kerry Werner: That was my first Nationals podium in the Elite race, so I was pumped on that. It's hard to say that venue necessarily suits me. Regardless of the venue, if those conditions were at any venue it would have suited me because it was just frozen ruts. It was basically a clinic on technical ability. Obviously a little bit of fitness in there too, but you couldn't go out there and just pedal and not think about how to turn your bike. It will be really interesting to see how they lay out the course and also what the conditions will be.

As we've seen, Eric is going to be really really hard to beat if it's dry, but if there's any bit of moisture with the hillside they have there and the elevation changes they can incorporate into the course, they could make a really tricky track. That would obviously play to my strong suits.

Zach Schuster: I feel like you've generally brought your best to Nationals. Louisville was a struggle, perhaps. Save Gage's ride into the tape, you could have won in Lakewood. But last year, I don't think you brought your best to Nationals. I think you left there with a bitter taste in your mouth; does that motivate you going into this year?

Kerry Werner: That was one of those races where you get, I don't know, 30 seconds into the race and basically by the time I came out of the sand pit, I was like, "It's going to be a long hour."

Zach Schuster: It was wild. You could just see on your face; I was like, "What is happening?"

Kerry Werner: I don't know how much that was mental or physical or a combination of both, but it did suck. I was not stoked about it. I think this year with the change up of the schedule and hopefully having a little bit left in the tank for the end of the year, I am really looking forward to Nationals.

Werner has some unfinished business after a disappointing day at Cantigny Nationals. © Zach Schuster

Zach Schuster: It seems like you've relished that role of being the guy folks kind of forget about. Being the guy who comes in and stirs shit up.

Kerry Werner: Yeah, I do like the stir the pot. Pressure is fun and having that standard put on you is a sign of respect, I guess. Brunner deserves to be the guy, which is also nice for me because I think I do better when I don't place heavy expectations on myself. I can just go out there and figure it out in the moment. That seems to work better for me.

Zach Schuster: We're going to get to the listener questions. You ready for these?

Kerry Werner: Let's do it.

Zach Schuster: We'll start with a softball. Does Sherman prefer gravel or 'cross?

Kerry Werner: Absolutely 'cross races.

Zach Schuster: Is he as famous on the gravel scene as he is in cyclocross? Because he is an absolute celebrity in cyclocross.

Kerry Werner: That's the thing with the gravel venue, there really isn't one. You show up at 7 in the morning at the start line, and unless you're a sponsor of the event, you don't really set your tent up. There's not the rolling convoy that is the family and community of cyclocross. Sherm thrives in that. Even this weekend, he was bumping around all the tents saying hi and looking for people's dropped food.

Sherman is a celebrity on the cyclocross scene and always at home there. © Bill Schieken

Zach Schuster: That leads to a question I had. I've done gravel, and they talk about the gravel family, and I went back to Wisconsin, to my cyclocross home, and I don't want to be too hokey, but I felt like it was home. I saw familar faces, everyone is stoked on cyclocross. We were standing out in 20-degree weather and it's snowing. What's the vibe check been for the gravel scene? I mean, you're probably the most famous cyclocross racer in American cyclocross.

Kerry Werner: I appreciate that. Every time I go somewhere, people are like, "What's 'cross like?" and I'm just like, "Dude, it's great. The first five races of the year had over a thousand people at every weekend. Everyone is acting like 'cross is dead, and I think that was the communal thought coming into the season, but I think those first five races quashed that.

I think maybe because I am more used to it and am more familiar with the 'cross side of things, it fits my personality. I've been trying to warm up to these gravel venues. Like I said, it just doesn't have that feel. Every weekend you go to a 'cross race and it has the same people, the same setups, so you pop around and get to know people really well throughout the season. While you still see the same people, more or less, at a gravel event, it doesn't have that homey feel. All the components just aren't always there.

Zach Schuster: We got a question from GasStationFoodCyclist. They want to know what you're mid-ride haul looks like.

Kerry Werner: That's a good one. Usually it's a soda pop, usually a Coke of some sort and a candy bar. I'm a sucker for when gas stations, especially around here in the sticks of Virginia, you get what look like homemade apple turnovers that sit up by the cash register. I always check those things out because it's always different.

But if I have to pick something I know is going to be at every place, Chex Mix for salty, crunchy stuff. Sometimes when I am on a ride, I need crunch because otherwise it's just the same texture and that gets old. And then classics like a Snickers or Payday.

Zach Schuster: I'm with you on the crunch. I find myself going for potato chips because I normally don't eat them, but I want that salt and I also want that crunch. I'm sick of eating bars.

Keeping it on the realm of food, what happens if you don't have pancakes in the morning the day of a race?

Kerry Werner: Ummmmm, cereal. Cinnamon Toast Crunch. I've been going that route for the gravel races because god, they're so early. Getting up three hours before is just not feasible. I usually go lighter on the breakfast--well I guess I don't know how much lighter two giant bowls of Cinnamon Toast Crunch is, but that's what I go for.

Zach Schuster: Have you had the cereal bars? There's like a Lucky Charms bar.

Kerry Werner: Oh yeah! I forgot about those. Dude, I can't do the Lucky Charms because something about that marshmallow texture in there, I don't like that. But hey, if that's your thing, there's no judgement here.

Zach Schuster: This next question, I don't know if I've ever officially asked this. We saw with Clambitchen Memes, we saw with that video, you've got several alter egos. What are your official feelings about us calling you Kenny and not really caring what your feelings are about it?

Kerry Werner: Dude, I love it. I think it's awesome. I love how people get creative with it. Honestly, I dropped the ball this weekend. I was going to at least show up at pre-ride with a big mustache on.

clambitchen_memes

A post shared by Little Bits (@clambitchen_memes)

Zach Schuster: Dude, dude, the 'stache from Collegiate Nats? You've got like three weeks here.

Kerry Werner: Maybe Kenny will race the single speed race.

Kenny has made previous appearances at Nationals.

Zach Schuster: We got a question from Austin, she wants to know if Jerry Werner likes fixies.

Kerry Werner: That's funny because any time Emily types my name into her phone, it autocorrects to Jerry. It stings, especially because it's my wife. And she doesn't bother to change it back.

I think Jerry is into fixies. I think he does the flip-hub thing.

Zach Schuster: Your wife has been crushing it this year. What's it been like as the proud husband watching her success?

Kerry Werner: She has been crushing it. Chris McGovern was getting on my case this weekend. He was like, "Yeah man, Emily has been absolutely killing it at all the races you don't go to."

I've been really pumped for her. She's been doing really well this season. She had some bad luck this past weekend, so I think the fire is burning pretty hot to really close the domestic scene down with a good result at Nats. Then she's going over to Europe for Kerstperiode through the Spain World Cup. She's really hoping to get to Worlds this year. She missed out on Worlds last year and was only a spot or two away, which kind of hurt.

Zach Schuster: We got another question that said that "nobody" is racing in Europe right now, but then someone pointed out that Clara Honsinger is racing right now. I feel riders might have gone over during this period in previous years, but it feels like riders are staying closer to home now.

Kerry Werner: I think it's tough. There are a couple of things at play. For me personally, I've never gone over until after Nationals for Kerstperiode, or when Nationals were in January, I would go over after Nationals. That travel is tough, and to throw it in at the end of the season when you've been chasing the circuit for so long, it makes it that much tougher. I don't really blame anybody for not going over there to fight for, historically, a top 30, top 20 spot. It just doesn't seem super worth it, and it's a lot of stress. It's a lot of strain on the budget. You have to take a bunch of equipment over there, just to bring it back.

Zach Schuster: Another question we got is what's up with the incognito kit. Is that part of the schtick of being the underdog here?

Kerry Werner: Everybody has been like, "Dude, do you still have a sponsor?" Yeah man, my sponsor just chose to go with 7mesh's stuff. I love the 7mesh stuff, but they just don't do custom kits. They do sublimination stuff, so on most of my stuff, I have a Kona logo on the jersey, but they don't go into the full custom stuff. That's why.

They also don't do skinsuits, so I've been able to mix it up and do different colors. I kind of like the all-black kit I wore at Hendersonville.

Zach Schuster: I've become kind of obsessed with the idea of the guy who shows up in the all-black kit at a group. Everyone's got their team kits on, and some guy shows up in an all-black kit and just crushes everyone. Smashes the shit out of the group ride. Does that give you a bit of energy, being the black kit guy?

Kerry Werner: Absolutely dude. You nailed it right on the head. I like showing up without a ton of logos on my jersey and throwing down. It's kind of a paradox, I guess, because while I am the black kit guy, depending on what you want to call me--Kerry or Kenny or Jerry--I also have the history, so everyone already knows who I am. It kind of cancels out.

It kind of fits with the persona of not racing 'cross full time and then showing up in the all-black kit. It pairs with that really well.

Zach Schuster: Are you going to be wearing that at Nats?

Kerry Werner: It depends what the temps are like, but I will definitely be packing black bibs and a jersey. It's a possibility.

Werner went with the all-black 7mesh kit for the NCGP. © BIll Schieken

Zach Schuster: We'll close with my two favorite questions. Thanks to everyone who submitted their questions on Twitter, while it still exists. Friend of Cyclocross Leslie Ethridge wants to know why you're doing Single Speed Nationals if you haven't raced single speed all year.

Kerry Werner: Yeah, I haven't raced it all year. I've done one single speed race in my entire career. It was in 2020, there was a local race down in Tennessee, and I tried it out because 2020 was the year of change.

Man, for me, Nationals is always such a mental struggle because you go to a place, everybody is there, there is a huge amount of hype surrounding the event, which is cool and it's what makes Nationals, Nationals. But it's just tough because you just sit around in a house, and you don't do more than a 2-hour ride all week. You've checked the course out earlier in the week, so then you're just sitting around playing race scenarios in your head all week. Stressing yourself out about it.

This was my way of taking pressure off myself by not just sitting around and putting a huge emphasis on Sunday's race. I figured doing Single Speed Saturday would be a paid way to check out the race lines at speed instead of getting bombarded during the course inspection time. I don't know, I just wanted to change it up. This is the year of change for me for cyclocross, so I thought it would be cool to try.

Zach Schuster: It might be a little controversial with folks. Your explanation makes total sense. But, I feel like you could really endear yourself to the community by doing two things here. One, Kenny. The 'stache. Two, wearing a costume.

Kerry Werner: I'm not making any promises on the costume. I'm not much of a costume guy. I could throw a mustache on no problem. But throw jorts on over my chamois, I'm not quite there.

Zach Schuster: This last one is very much an asking for a friend situation. I'm actually asking this for a friend! We'll just call him ... C. Swartz. I don't want to give away too much. Here it is, how does he beat you in a sprint?

Kerry Werner: Hahahahaha. Well, I think maybe let me tack on a few more years and let my muscles get tired. That's all he's getting man. There's no secret formula.

Zach Schuster: Oh, so you know who's asking this question. If you know who's asking, we don't want to give away too much.

Kerry Werner: Here's a good one. I would say always lead it out. Always be the guy on the front.

Zach Schuster: That never doesn't work.

Kerry Werner: Always lead it out.

Zach Schuster: This ruled. We had some good questions. I appreciate that you're always up for a good time. It was awesome to see you back racing 'cross. I'm super stoked to see you at Nats. I don't know, you've just been such an integral part of American cyclocross and during these tough times for the sport, a lot of credit goes to you for keeping the stoke high. I hope you feel that.

Kerry Werner: I do, and I appreciate you and everybody else saying that to me. People have reached out to let me know they miss me at the scene. It's nice, and it definitely doesn't go unheard. It's always nice to feel the love.

That's what I mean. Everyone is saying 'cross is dead, but 'cross still has the love. At least in my book and in my heart. You're just surrounding yourself with all the people who just as hyped about it as you are. It's a good symbiotic relationship.

Zach Schuster: I like it. You always have a great way of putting things. I always appreciate the little nuggs you drop.